Silver cup

PHOTOS REQUIRED - marks + item
TK O'Reilly
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:07 am
Location: calgary ab canada

Silver cup

Postby TK O'Reilly » Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:47 pm

I have a silver cup that I was told is a christening cup from Norway or Sweden. It has the name of Johannesen engraved under it's rim. It also has the letters IF stamped on the bottom. The first digit may be the number 1 but the letter F follows. The decorative tool work is quite ornate and I would like to date and locate it's origin if possilbe.
I have posted 2 images titled tko1 and tko2 on letmehost.com but could not tag them as laid out in your guideline.Letmehost has provided a forum link as follows:

http://sv1.letmehost.com/sv1/13/tko1_004.JPG

http://sv1.letmehost.com/sv1/13/tko2_001.JPG

Thanks for any information, tko

dragonflywink
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Postby dragonflywink » Sat Feb 18, 2006 11:46 pm

What a lovely piece! Can't help with the maker, appears to me to be "IF". It's a drink tumbler (the original round-bottomed form), the owner would have been an adult, as they were usually used for brandy. The "sen" suffix on the engraved name (if original) would point to Danish or Norwegian origin. Have seen Danish pieces illustrated, with similar acanthus leaf chase-work, dating to the late 17th/early 18th century.

Cheryl ;o)

Hose_dk
contributor
Posts: 1463
Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 1:39 pm
Location: Denmark

Postby Hose_dk » Sun Jun 04, 2006 8:11 am

Write the text here and I shall see what i can do.
I have found IF - or that is I have found a possible IF. The problem is that if he is the man we lack 3 marks.
1 for the town, 1 for the Guardein and 1 for the month of production.

This can however be OK depending upon the weight of the item.
If the weight is less that 73grams we have found a possible maker.

So fill in the missing and i shall see again.

It can also be made out of a coin (I am not kidding) then it should not have marks.
How does the top look like. How is the edge (I dont know the word) I mean the top - picture from top into the item.

TK O'Reilly
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:07 am
Location: calgary ab canada

Silver cup

Postby TK O'Reilly » Wed Jun 07, 2006 8:19 pm

I am so pleased with this forum and it's members, thankyou for your efforts. Dragonflywink informed me that what I had was a drinking cup so I went looking for a lip print and to my shock found the rim has over 30 letters and numbers on it. I hope the new pics and the letters I have sent as they are laid down on the top rim will help you Hose_dk. Some of the letters are not clear, are my interpretation and may be confusing but there is a clear date; Dec VS. The cups weight is 28 grams. The pics and printed letters are on letmehost.com as follows.
http://sv1.letmehost.com/img.php?file=s ... 29_002.JPG
http://sv1.letmehost.com/img.php?file=s ... CT0334.JPG
http://sv1.letmehost.com/img.php?file=s ... CT0332.JPG
I apologize for the image size, I could not make the thumbnail link work.
Thankyou for your time and effort.

Tim

admin
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:52 pm

Postby admin » Wed Jun 07, 2006 8:37 pm

Try this - DECVS ET TVTAMEN ANNO REGNI?
The little tumbler is most likely made from a silver coin and the letters are what once was the milled edge of the coin.
I've seen a number of these and heard some unlikely tales of why, where and when they were made. If anyone does know the history, We'd all really like to know more about them.
Regards, Tom

ps. Image size is fine for a link, but tough on those with dial up connections, probably a few minutes for each image to load. You might consider adjusting your camera settings or reducing the pic size in photoshop or another pic program.

Hose_dk
contributor
Posts: 1463
Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 1:39 pm
Location: Denmark

Postby Hose_dk » Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:43 pm

OH yes this piece is definetely made of a coin.
Now this link brings you to a page in swedish. So you will not be able to understand. However observe the pictures. An expert writing at that page has a series of pictures. He is "changing" a canadian 10$ coin into a cup.
http://www.antikviteter.net/antikprat/m ... 36920.html

As you cannot understand the words just follow the pictures.

Observe that the edge of the coin is left untouched. So is yours.
Last edited by Hose_dk on Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hose_dk
contributor
Posts: 1463
Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 1:39 pm
Location: Denmark

Postby Hose_dk » Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:08 pm

Thank you for the mail. If have a fixed link so no problem with the size of pictures. I give my answer here - so that other might benefit.

I cannot make any sence of the words. However there is no doubht that this cup is made from a coin. In that case they did not put any mark at the item. That is as I have just been told normal procedure during 1700++)
In that case the text might tell a numismatiker which coin that was used.

IF is properly Johan Fuchs born in Berlin approx.1783.
Obtained citysenship in 27th of march 1811 stops as a silver smith 13th of february 1850 dies 1856. He lived in Copenhagen. Which makes sence with the name.

The coin is most likely one of the large silvercoins used during the king Christian VII - king of Denmark and Norway. However I am not able to identify. And it has been changed a lot from coin til cup:)


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